[Note: This should have been a reply to the Bryan's message, since I didn't wind up responding to any of Sean's comments. I was just lazy and didn't want to change what message I was replying to and subsequently have to change all the quoting. Sorry. :-/ ] On Thu, 2005-06-09 at 07:58 -0400, Sean wrote: > On Thu, June 9, 2005 6:26 am, Bryan J. Smith said: > > People aren't picking "nVidia-only" application. They are picking > > nVidia to run those _open_standard_ applications on nVidia hardware for > > now. They are _not_ tying themselves into nVidia-only applications. > > > > I think that's the point I keep seeing people miss. And why the whole > > "open" v. "proprietary" can be demonized to make anyone's argument stick > > to whatever ideal they want. I don't think you read my message very carefully. I know what your talking about regarding open v. proprietary, but that was not at all the gist of my message. I'm talking about Free Software in the FSF sense of the phrase. That's what matters to me, and it is what I want to continue to matter to the Fedora Project and, going forward, the Fedora Foundation. > > But I really hate seeing _both_sides_ go at it with *0* understanding > > and all sorts of _unrelated_ "open" non-sense. Like talking about > > proprietary libraries, when we're talking just hardware and drivers that > > does _open_standard_ GLX! Again, I haven't seen many, if any people arguing about whether or not nVidia is designing their cards and drivers to an open standard. But you're starting to sound like Sun's Jonathan Schwartz. To him, and some others in the industry, open standards matter more than source code under a Free license. That's not the case with the Fedora Project and I, at least, am going to lobby to keep it that way. And although that doesn't mean deliberately breaking closed source kernel modules, it does mean having zero concern about whether or not they break. We leave that completely in the hands of those who have chosen keep their source closed. I make sacrifices when there isn't a Free Software solution for the job I need to do. I'm not talking about work here...there, sure, I don't always have a choice. But I know the folly of my ways. I'm a reluctantly loyal user VMware since version 1.0. But when it breaks -- which it does just often enough to be annoying after some kernel updates -- I get to keep all the pieces. I don't complain on the Fedora lists that VMware is broken again. When I get the chance, I bitch at VMware, where my wrath should be directed. Even if it was free-as-in-beer software like nVidia's drivers, I wouldn't be complaining here. And, of course, I fully intend to stop purchasing upgrades to VMware when Xen is a viable replacement for me. But I know my folly, and that it is *my* folly. I help people to get it working when the latest kernel update precipitates a another breakage. Never, NEVER, would I argue that Fedora should make it easy for VMware to keep their drivers closed. I want pressure to be placed on VMware to open at least those kernel modules so that core kernel developers can help when they break. EVEN when it inconveniences me. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@xxxxxxxxxx http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
