On Fri, Jun 26, 2020 at 8:58 AM Vitaly Zaitsev via devel <devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > I'm strongly against this proposal. BTRFS is the most unstable file > system I ever seen. It can break up even under an ideal conditions and > lead to a complete data loss. There are lots of complaints and bug > reports in Linux kernel bugzilla and Reddit. I've got a Samsung 840 EVO that I know has firmware bugs. Is that an ideal condition? What about compiling webkitgtk and losing control of the system under load (unresponsive GUI while the compiling continues to write)? Is it an ideal condition? And because I'm notoriously impatient, I often yank the power cord. Ideal condition? And I've done this over 100 times in the last year. Ideal condition? 100% of the subsequent cold boots, boot identical to that of a prior clean shutdown. Zero btrfs complaints. One person, one laptop, one SSD. I'm not a totally disqualified scientific sample but it's a really insignificant anecdote, other than even at this scale if there were intrinsic file system defects, I think I'd have seen it. Question is, what happens when the firmware has a hiccup and I also get a power fail. What am I likely to see, and what do I do? When there are problems, we're used to a particular pattern with ext4. That pattern will change with btrfs. There will be fewer of some problems, more of others, and the messages will be different. fsck.ext4 is pretty much all we have, all we're used to, and it's a binary pass/fail. Even though we're talking about edge cases at this level, those who get unlucky for whatever reason are going to need a community of user to user support giving them good advice. Will Fedora? It's also important to talk about what's left on the table *without* this change. The potential to almost transparently drop in a new file system that extends the life of user's hardware, eliminates the free space competition problem between /home and /, and allocates it more efficiently. And asks *less* of day to day users, while inviting *more* from those who want to explore more features. On the same file system. The fear/concern component is real, it has to be addressed and not dismissed. But that component is already present with what we have. We're just used to it. Is there enough of a sense of adventure and bravery in Fedora to overcome the fear component, and in exchange we get a modern file system that actually helps us solve problems we're having today right now? And offers features that beg for future creativity and innovation? I think the answer is yes, but the Fedora community is going to have to decide. -- Chris Murphy _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
