Re: The state of Python 3.8 in Fedora 31

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On Mon, Jun 17, 2019 at 9:52 PM Miro Hrončok <mhroncok@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> When I filed the Python 3.8 [change] for Fedora 31, we knew that the schedule
> would be tight.
>
> For that very reason, we have not yet started to build for Python 3.8 in a f31
> side tag, but instead we've only been doing it in [copr] so far.
>
> The mass rebuild happens on 2019-07-24, according to the Fedora 31 [schedule].
> That gives us about 1 month + 1 week to be able to merge the side tag back in
> case we decide to start building it now.
>
> There are several challenges:
>
>   - there are ~200 build failures that block this, tracked on [bugzilla]
>   - further there are about ~300 packages that are blocked by the above,
> possibly more
>   - some of the packages are quite crucial to make this happen (tornado, pygobject3)
>   - the 3.8.0 [releases] have been delayed so far, so continuing the trend, we
> could very well end up with the first RC just one day before the F31 Final
> Freeze or even after that (risking 3.8 beta in Fedora 31 GA)
>
> I've met with Petr Viktorin and Tomáš Orsava today and we are prepared to deffer
> this change to Fedora 32, unless there is a large push-back against that.
> However we don't want this to be an internal decision behind closed doors, so we
> are sharing it with you and we are happy to reconsider, in case there is
> something that we haven't anticipated.

Hi Miro,

Reading your arguments below, I don't have any objections to deferring
python 3.8 to fedora 32.
However, I'm only affected with a few python packages, so I'm not sure
how heavily my opinion will weigh here ;)

> What would that mean:
>   - we would continue to build the packages in [copr] as new Python 3.8 beta
> versions are released
>   - we would continue to report build failures and to provide pointers to
> affected maintainers
>   - right after the F32 branching (2019-08-13 according to the [schedule]), we
> would start with the side tag builds

This is probably a typo, you must mean "just after the F31 branching", right?

>   - the Koji builds would start ~2 months later
>
> Benefits:
>   - we would not be stressed by the immediate mass rebuild deadline
>   - we would not need to care about ABI incompatibilities between beta releases,
> because the last beta should be out when we start
>
> Negatives:
>   - the users would get 3.8 as the main python3 about 6 months later, but they
> already have Python 3.8 interpreter in Fedora to develop on

I don't think this is a big issue, even more so if python upstream
delays their releases even further (reducing the "delay" for fedora).

Thanks for working on this!
Fabio

> We could of course just start building now and than decide not to merge the side
> tag, but we are worried that it would leave a big mess in git repos and RPM
> changelogs.
>
> If you think this is not a wise decision and would prefer to have Python 3.8 in
> Fedora 31 (as the main python3), please discuss quickly. The F31 mass rebuild is
> approaching fast and there's a lot to be done, so every day counts now; in other
> words, the later you present your argument, the stronger it must be ;)
>
> [change] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Python3.8
> [copr] https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/g/python/python3.8/
> [schedule] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/31/Schedule
> [bugzilla]
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/showdependencytree.cgi?id=PYTHON38&hide_resolved=1
> [releases] https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0569/#schedule
>
> Miro Hrončok,
> on behalf of the Fedora's Python SIG
> and Red Hat's Python Maintenance team
> --
> Phone: +420777974800
> IRC: mhroncok
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