On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 4:46 PM Randy Barlow <bowlofeggs@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-09-25 at 14:18 +0000, Máirín Duffy wrote: > > - Is running a lightweight local VM for web development a usecase we > > want to support? Is it dare I ask important? > > - If so, is what I ended up setting up what we want people in that > > usecase to do? (E.g. use Fedora cloud base image, set up in virt- > > manager or boxes, using virt-customize to remove cloud-init and > > configure login password? > > Hi Máirín! > > Have you considered using Vagrant for this? It makes it easy to script > a reproducible development virtual machine, so that you can quickly > destroy and recreate it on demand. I use it to develop Bodhi and I've > been mostly pretty happy with it (it does have some weird warts too, > but mostly works well). Bodhi uses Vagrant to start up the guest, and > then Vagrant asks Ansible to configure it to be a Bodhi dev box. Here's > the file that makes it go: > > https://github.com/fedora-infra/bodhi/blob/3.10.0/Vagrantfile > > The playbook Vagrant runs is here: > > https://github.com/fedora-infra/bodhi/tree/3.10.0/devel/ansible > > And here are instructions that describe what it's like for a developer > to use it: > > > https://github.com/fedora-infra/bodhi/blob/3.10.0/docs/developer/vagrant.rst > > I recommend this or something like this over making a more "permanent" > VM, because it makes it easy to share the valuable development > environment with others (or even with yourself on multiple machines), > and because it makes it a non-issue when the guest gets damaged in some > way (rather than spending time debugging a guest I've broken, I just > vagrant destroy && vagrant up, go make some coffee, and when I'm back I > have a fresh working instance again). OK. So this suggestion is well intentioned. It's even a good one, IMHO. However, look at this from a non-Fedora view. The conversation went like this: <random dev> Hey, I'm trying to do this and all the documented Fedora things are really hard or poorly documented. Is this how Fedora should work? <Fedora dev> Oh, use this thing that *Fedora doesn't produce* in a manner that *Fedora doesn't document* instead. It's much better! That is a really bad anti-pattern. If we think Vagrant is better for this kind of work, we should be actively looking at producing vagrant images instead. Then people would have the documentation and tools they need. If we don't think Vagrant is a good solution here, we should be working to improve the solutions we have and documentation for them to make them less confusing. If we do neither of those things, <random dev> is going to be left wondering why they used Fedora in the first place. josh _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://getfedora.org/code-of-conduct.html List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
