Adam Williamson wrote: > On Tue, 2012-05-29 at 16:50 -0400, Tom Callaway wrote: >> On 05/29/2012 04:46 PM, Corey Richardson wrote: >> > I've heard nothing but bad things about preupgrade from lots of people, >> > and I've heard the developers either never hear about it, ignore it, or >> > don't care. I tried a preupgrade and it half-succeeded, I had to fix >> > the initramfs and a few other things afterwards though. IMO, it isn't >> > worth the pain. >> >> We do test preupgrade as part of the pre-release testing. The problem is >> that people do all sorts of wacky things to their systems that cause it >> to not work well. I'm sure that QA would love to have more people >> testing preupgrade during the beta->RC window. >> >> So, your statement that devs don't care isn't valid. It may still not be >> worth the pain, depending on how much you have installed outside of the >> Fedora Package universe. > > Not entirely valid, but if we're being completely honest, there is only > one preupgrade maintainer - hughsie - and he has a couple of other > full-time jobs. So I think it's fair to say it doesn't get as much > active maintenance as it might. The preupgrade bug list is quite long - > 127 bugs, http://bugz.fedoraproject.org/preupgrade - and I know for a > fact it contains quite a few valid reports which could be fixed > by...development. > > Your broader point is of course also true. upgrading is a fundamentally > unsupportable operation: the amount of variables in play when it comes > to upgrading a system which a person has been using, normally, for some > time is so huge as to be probably incalculable. What we test in a > programmed way is that you can do a clean installation of F16, update it > to current packages, then run 'preupgrade' and wind up with an F17 > system that boots. That is the extent of the preupgrade validation > testing. Any further testing relies on people trying it and filing bugs, > as Tom says. > > The particular failure scenario involved here - 'user let > SOME_THIRD_PARTY_THING screw up RPM-managed files' - is obviously quite > a long way down the list of things we're going to care about. There has > to be a limit to what we can achieve with the resources available to a > project like Fedora. We don't have a 2,000 system test lab stashed away > somewhere with a few hundred people in it running upgrade tests in > various arbitrary scenarios, 24 hours a day. We just don't. All we can > do is ask people to test and file bugs prior to release, and I think we > certainly do enough of that... But we can, and should, at least try to make our systems tolerant of failures. Just because we can't test everything. Defensive programming. -- devel mailing list devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
