On 11/26/2009 02:14 PM, Rudolf Kastl wrote:
2009/11/26 Terry Barnaby<terry1@xxxxxxxxxxx>:
Ok, controversial title.
I have just tried to test install F12 on some of my systems, (5 different
ones).
All of these bar 1 has problems with the graphics (X11 lockups, system
lockups
and other problems) mainly in 3D but also in 2D.
I still am using F8 on most of my systems as the Graphics systems have not
been stable enough for 3D in Fedora since around those times.
which cards exactly did you try? which drivers do you use... and what
are the bugzilla bug numbers?
The "cards" I have tried include:
Intel Corporation 82945G/GZ Integrated Graphics Controller
ATI Technologies Inc RV535 [Radeon X1650 Series]
ATI Technologies Inc M22 [Mobility Radeon X300]
ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 PRO] (rev 01)
VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82G33/G31 Express Integrated
Graphics Controller (rev 02)
I have not entered any bugzilla numbers as yet. I spent days with F11 and
previous releases diagnosing reporting and attempting to fix bugs. No
graphics updates were ever made available for F11 and still Fedora cannot
run even Blender on most of my machines. At the moment I am not convinced that
it is worth spending this time on F12. It seems likely no updates will
appear and in F13 the whole ball game may have changed anyway.
As an idea, at this stage, how about canceling the F13 release and just
fixing and updating the F12 release ? This will concentrate developers and
users into one system release. Similar to the pre-release test days we could
have
post-release test days. For example a Graphics test day for F12 where
a certain set of tests with a test suite and a set of well known
applications
could be run. As F12 would be out longer, more people could participate in
this.
i dont see the point because that will definitely lead to new
regressions in f12 and annoy other people. interested partys can at
any time of the development cycle test the current state of
development (aka rawhide) and report and fix bugs in it.
For testing Graphics you need a lot of "testers". I would not have thought
that the number of people testing rawhide is enough. I would have thought
that real users actually using Fedora are required here.
Certainly the F12 release seems to reflect the lack of 3D graphics testing ...
my personal experience is:
intel (i965) works fine... there are some problems with shaders i have
to investigate and there is a problem with interlaced resolutions.
even displayport output works (hooked up to a fullhd tv via
displayport -> hdmi adapter)
radeon 4650 works fine... even 3d works to some extent with the
experimental dri drivers.... testing a new mesa build from koji even
fixed various issues with 3d games i had left... also some
effects/shaders seem to be not properly implemented yet... but hey...
it is experimental)
nvidia: nouveau kernel mode setting works and 2d experience is alot
better already.
2d works in all setups i have personally tested. 3d still requires
some progress but i dont see how it helps to stay on one release to
get them resolved.
Yes, some graphics boards I am sure work well, although 3D should really
be working on all cards in 2009 ...
But this is the point, there are a lot of different graphics boards, and
so a much wider scope for the testing is required here which requires more
users over more time with many different applications using basically the
same software.
kind regards,
Rudolf Kastl
If a commitment, all round, to producing updates fixing the issues in F12
were made, I think more people would be willing to participate as users
could
expect to see a stable system for their efforts.
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