>When is the next set of SCOPE meetings? Timo, Do you have SCOPE meetings schedule? -Terence >-----Original Message----- >From: Jim Zemlin [mailto:jzemlin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] >Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 9:43 AM >To: Chen, Terence >Cc: timo.jokiaho@xxxxxxx; lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >Subject: Re: Starting the 5.0 charter process > >When is the next set of SCOPE meetings? > >Jim > >On Aug 17, 2007, at 9:06 AM, Chen, Terence wrote: > >> Glenn, Timo, >> >> I think the flow of what you described makes sense in high level; >> however, it will be good for both organizations to sit down to follow >> through and work out the working model to streamline the activities >> and >> logistics such as gap analysis, requirements, implementation, and LSB >> type of testing... >> >> The question is when and where. >> >> -Terence >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: lf_carrier-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> [mailto:lf_carrier- >>> bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of timo.jokiaho@xxxxxxx >>> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 3:09 AM >>> To: lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> Subject: RE: Starting the 5.0 charter process >>> >>> >>> Glenn et.al >>> >>> We at Nokia Siemens Networks have a firm opinion that these kind of >> RFPs >>> should come >>> from SCOPE Alliance (note, this is Nokia Siemens Networks opinion, >>> not >>> SCOPE at least yet). >>> >>> What we also think is that collectively we should start concentrating >> on >>> working towards >>> consistent Carrier Grade API set within Carrier Grade OS domain, like >> CG >>> Linux. In order >>> to do that, the following model is proposed: >>> >>> * LF-CGL would be primarily become implementors group with Carrier >> Grade >>> focus. >>> SCOPE Alliance develops gap / requirement document and spells out >> the >>> need for APIs >>> related to the gaps / requirements. This will given to LF-CGL, >>> which >>> then starts developing >>> the APIs themselves. The development process should be full >> consensus >>> based. When the >>> APIs are defined, LF CGL includes the new APIs into LSB CGL module >>> and they would >>> then be automatically included into LSB certification process. >>> >>> In addition to this SCOPE would continue to profile existing API >>> specs >>> and then provides the >>> profile (priorities) to LF-CGL group, which then works on those and >>> makes sure they will be >>> included into LSB CGL module. They would then be included into LSB >>> certification process. >>> >>> Any thoughts ? >>> >>> Cheers >>> >>> TimoJ >>> >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: lf_carrier-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> [mailto:lf_carrier-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of >> ext >>> >>>> Seiler, Glenn >>>> Sent: 16 August, 2007 12:45 >>>> To: lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> Subject: Starting the 5.0 charter process >>>> >>>> We need to start this process that we agreed to back in June at >>>> the LF >>>> LinuxSummit. >>>> >>>> To that end I'll start by putting some concepts out for discussion >>>> before starting a draft of the charter. >>>> >>>> The first and most important thing that strikes me about the new >>>> charter we [loosely] agreed to in June is that it is a very >> fundamental >>> >>>> shift from the original charter. To be more clear; the original >> charter >>> >>>> was to define characteristics of a Carrier Grade system - some >>>> existing, some not - that must be present in order for a system >>>> to be >>>> defined as Carrier Grade. >>>> These requirements came directly from NEPS and Telecom platform >>>> providers - those most knowledgeable to provide such >>>> requirements. The >>>> result was a blueprint that distro's could map against and NEPs >>>> could >>>> use as a sort of metric. >>>> >>>> If we move to charter to essentially specify gaps - things not in >>>> the >>>> current Linux kernel and associated packages - then the document, or >>>> spec, or whatever it becomes, cannot really be used to define >>>> capabilities of an OS, because by definition, the requirements do >>>> not >>>> exist. Ok, so maybe a distro may have a few of the 'non-existing' >> gaps, >>> >>>> but for the most part it becomes a document that no one can >>>> really map >>>> against. >>>> >>>> So the charter changes significantly; rather than a document that >>>> defines the characteristics of a CG system, it now becomes a >>>> "message >>>> to the industry of what Telcos need and isn't available". A wish >>>> list. >>>> My fundamental question is "what value to the NEPs is a wish list"? >>>> Perhaps great value. >>>> But I am not the right person to answer that question. Now if the >>>> community reacts - either through LF, through distros and platform >>>> providers, or through grass-roots projects, then this document can >>>> become of great value. But if the community does not react, it >>>> becomes >>>> a nice exercise. >>>> >>>> The concept of registration, or certification, or LSB module >>>> essentially goes away. How do you certify or register against things >>>> that do not exist yet? I suspect that will make some very happy, >>>> but I >>>> think it is a great shame. >>>> >>>> So, with my preamble out of the way, and a basic question asked >>>> of the >>>> key consumers of this document, here are some ideas for moving >> forward. >>>> >>>> 1) we should create the document similar to an RFP. The RFP should >> come >>> >>>> from LF. It should be an RFP for CG requirements not met today. This >>>> process would give equal opportunity to everyone; SCOPE Alliance, >>>> individuals in the community, distros and platform providers all >>>> would >>>> equal opportunity to submit requirements. >>>> >>>> 2) Just like an RFP, there should be a timeframe for responding. >>>> >>>> 3) There should be a "maintainer" of the requirements that resolves >>>> conflicting requirements, overlaps and redundancies. >>>> Without a 'maintainer' the process would quickly become chaos. >>>> >>>> 4) The maintainer should be a neutral party, (..LF). If not, some >>>> democratic process should be created to determine a maintainer. >>>> >>>> 5) There should be a template that 'suggests' the way requirements >>>> should be submitted. Nothing too rigid. The template should come >>>> from >>>> LF, with input from this list of course. >>>> >>>> 6) As we discussed in June, the requirements should be "What" >>>> of requirements that do not exist today. Not the "how". >>>> >>>> 7) I'm not sure this process or document should be restricted to the >>>> kernel proper. I suspect there are valid requirements in user >>>> space as >>>> well. >>>> >>>> --------------------- >>>> >>>> Ok, that is all I can think of now. I'm quite sure I am missing >>>> something and of course, this is an open process so I expect a lot >>>> comments. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> -glenn >>>> >>>> >>>> Glenn Seiler, General Manager Linux Solutions, Wind River direct >>>> +1.510.749.2122 mobile +1.831.334.4108 fax +1.510.749.2695 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Lf_carrier mailing list >>> Lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> https://lists.linux-foundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lf_carrier >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Lf_carrier mailing list >> Lf_carrier@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >> https://lists.linux-foundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lf_carrier > >------------------------------------------------- >Jim Zemlin >Executive Director, The Linux Foundation >210 Fell St. Suite 16 >San Francisco, CA 94102 >Cell: 415-726-2284 >Fax: 415-707-2153 >http://www.linux-foundation.org > >