Hi David and all, Is all of this inaccessibility in installation quite as big a deal as it is being made? Is it still possible to install Solaris through the serial console port? I did this a number of times as a sys admin using Solaris 6 and 7. Does that ability remain possible with 10? ----- Original Message ----- From: "david poehlman" <david.poehlman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list@xxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 10:39 AM Subject: Re: Solaris 10 released,with accessibility built-in! Also FreeTTS 1.2 released. (fwd) > The accessibility through remote may be from windows, but since windows is > not serving it up except through special calls, we are actually using what > is provided on the host. > > Johnnie Apple Seed > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kenny Hitt" <kenny@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list@xxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 12:21 PM > Subject: Re: Solaris 10 released,with accessibility built-in! Also FreeTTS > 1.2 released. (fwd) > > > Hi. > > On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 11:55:15AM -0800, Peter Korn wrote: > > Hi Michael, > > > > I am from Sun, so I don't qualify as the "non-Sun" person you are seeking. > > I also am sighted, so perhaps don't qualify as a sufficient authority by > > that measure. However, I may have some useful information, so I'll chime > > in... > > > > > > The priority for our first release, as informed by the letter of the rules > > in Section 508, was a usable, accessible desktop for end-users. This > > specifically meant that for the first release, accessible installation was > > a "nice to have", not a "must have". Solaris, unlike Linux, doesn't have > > a > > notion of virtual text consoles in which you can run Speakup or BrlTTY. > > You can run BrlTTY on Solaris (we have been shipping them on the Solaris > > Companion CD for a little while now), but it doesn't run at as low a level > > in Solaris as they do in Linux. See > > http://blogs.sun.com/roller/search/richb?q=Companion&c= for a blog entry > > from Rich Burridge on the contents of the Solaris Companion CD. > > > > GUI accessibility in Solaris 10 is very likely better than what most folks > > in the community have experienced. This isn't because we've "held stuff > > back", or "added secret sauce". Rather it is becaus there are a *lot* of > > components to put together to make this all work, and we've been building > > and testing the particular collection of versions for a while now in both > > Solaris and our upcoming Java Desktop System release 3 for Linux. Many of > > the problems folks have encountered are due in part to older, or > > mis-matched versions of things. Web browsing in particular is significant > > better using the Sun Mozilla branch (we've gotten about half of our > > accessibility patches put back to Mozilla trunk, with more going in every > > week; but the most accessible Mozilla on UNIX remains our branch, which is > > what we ship in Solaris 10). > > > > Are you still forced to read a web page line by line? If so, anyone > using speech for output will take much longer than they would with > lynx in a text console. Even on pages that work well with Mozilla, I > find it much faster to read the page with lynx. > > > So Solaris 10 is probably "beyond what is available in Linux" from the > > point of view of what most people have put together in Linux. But > > strictly > > speaking, *everything* we've done in Solaris 10 is "available" in Linux - > > you just have to do a bunch of work to put it together (and of course, > > that > > work is part of the value of going to a commercial, supported, UNIX distro > > and why many folks will pay Sun $50 for the retail edition of the Sun Java > > Desktop System). > > > > But... I wouldn't say that the shipping Solaris 10 is dramatically beyond > > what many have experienced on their own with Linux. Perhaps others will > > disagree - I've spent very little time trying to roll my own stuff on top > > of Debian or Fedora or what-have-you. Even so, this is a *first* release. > > Compared to outSPOKEN 1.0, or JAWS 1.0, I think this is far superior, and > > far more functional. And I personally know a number of folks who were > > pretty successful with outSPOKEN 1.0 (and especially outSPOKEN 1.1). And > > certainly compared to the built-in GUI access options on Windows, there is > > no question as to how much more functional Solaris 10 is. But we > > certainly > > have a good distance to go before we can rival JAWS 5.x, or ZoomText 8.x, > > or... And a user who is very comfortable and productive in the Linux > > console will probably find they prefer that environment - at least for > > many/most things. One blind user data-point to counter that: someone on > > one of the GNOME accessibility mailing lists said he has moved over to > > Gnopernicus and Mozilla exclusively for web browsing now, and no longer > > uses lynx. As they say, your mileage may vary... > > > I agree Gnome accessibility is better than what I had in Windows 3.11 > and JFW 2.0 back in 1996. I have switch to using Gnome for all my multi > media playback. Totem rocks! > > I find some types of file management are easier in nautilus than > they would be using wild cards in a terminal. I've also noticed I > usually have few problems with accessibility when I try a new gtk 2 app. > I have my system configured to boot to a gdm login and I always keep a > Gnome session running in addition to text consoles. > However, I still don't think it is possible for a blind person using > speech output to be productive using only Gnome and Gnopernicus. > I know that will eventually change, but it isn't there yet. > > You should be aware the person whoclames to be using Gnopernicus > and Mozilla instead of Lynx spends very little time running Linux. > Based on his mail headers and earlier posts from him, he spends > most of his time in MS Windows. I believe he uses Windows for his job, > so his Linux experience is only for short times on limited occasions. > > For accessibility purposes, I don't believe controlling a Linux box from > a Windows counts as Linux experience. True you know Unix commands, but > the accessibility is still from Windows. > > > Kenny > > _______________________________________________ > > Blinux-list@xxxxxxxxxx > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list > > _______________________________________________ > > Blinux-list@xxxxxxxxxx > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list > _______________________________________________ Blinux-list@xxxxxxxxxx https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list