On 01/01/2014 11:30 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
You are again missing the point that when evaluating changes, you can't do so against a hypothesized change that noone is working on. You will have to evaluate it against status quo vs someone willing to do the work involved. You are not volunteering to work on what you are proposing so it wouldn't get done unless someone else buys into your ideas and so far noone has.
I think you are missing the point. As I do not have the knowledge about anaconda nor other install related programs to do the change myself (which I would, if I was part of that group and had knowledge of Anaconda and related programs) my proposal could be regarded as a RFE to improve the handling of mail created by different programs and daemons.
Some regard mail sent to /var/spool/mail/root as lost, my proposal make these mails visible to the (chosen) user. This is a good thing. And, as it is now, in a new install of F20, these mail will be totally lost, they will not even end up in /var/spool/root. Which is a bad thing.
This by no means mean that I am not volunteering, it simply states that I do not have the knowledge to do these changes myself, nor am I part of the group working with those programs.
Is not one of the reasons for the these mailing lists to encourage people to discuss things like this (changes to improve Fedora)?
You haven't considered all the different use cases which makes it very difficult to make any meaningful decisions during installation time.
How could adding a user to /etc/aliases create any problems? It just tells the system which user should get the mail now sent to root.
The proposed question could (should) be asked when the system is restarted for the first time, and the first user is created. No implications come to mind.
In a system without users the mail ends up in root mail as now. No implications come to mind.
What use cases do I miss? And in what way would these "makes it very difficult to make any meaningful decisions during installation time". Could you give me any examples.
I won't list them but one quick example: Anaconda doesn't require you to create a user at installation time. Instead you can do so during initial-setup time and that user may not be a local user at all.
user@xxxxxxxxxxx added to /etc/aliases is also valid. Not adding anything to /etc/aliases is also valid (mail ends up in /var/spool/mail/root as before). Again, no implications come to mind.
The current design of the installer is to do the minimum needed during installation time and your proposal doesn't fit with that model either.
I have clarified the proposal above. The question about /etc/aliases is supposed to be asked when you create the first user of the system. If you chose not to use /etc/aliases, the mail ends up in root mail as before. It fits the current model without problems.
>> As always that depends on the use case (see at the end) I said common use cases. If you have to fallback to using grep, so be it but what journalctl offers is a supset of what traditional syslog daemons offer for a local user. That is undisputed.
A (very) common use case is that you want to find something in the log. The first thing you do then is 'grep /var/log/applicable_log_file'. Yes journalctl has options for some things that you use grep for when looking at the /var/log files, but for many use cases you still need to use grep (and as seen in my earlier post, it can take extremely long time grepping output from journalctl when the journal is big).
If you know a better way to search for a random text segment in the logs (using journalctl) than using grep, please let me know.
Unfiled bugs doesn't fundamentally change that although if you find any, you can file them and get the transition to be smoother.
Do you regard the sluggish journal I have as a bug? I will gladly file a bug if you think so.
Lars -- Lars E. Pettersson <lars@xxxxxxxx> http://www.sm6rpz.se/ -- users mailing list users@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
