Actually, this post is about attitude and professionalism in Fedora community. Lately I saw in to many threads negative attitude about suggestions, complains, bugs ... etc posted from users in this list. I got sick of it.
FOSS community become very hostile place, especially by developers. I doubt that Richard Stallman or any other leader from FSF, GNU would like to FOSS become such a place.
I'm aware of the fact that GNOME developers do not read this list. I'm aware of the fact that many Fedora/Red Hat maintainers do not read this list. But we don't have any other place to express our observations about Fedora distribution and included software.
Drop that spilled the cup is comments from Ankur aka FranciscoD about issue in this thread.
First things first: I'm in the Unix/Linux world more than this young Indian Tiger's age. Last 12 years main and almost only OS on my desktops, laptops, servers (at home and work) is Fedora/CentOS/RHEL. They satisfy my need in day-to-day work, research, entertainment ... etc. Using comps more than 8 hrs per day. So, I feel that I have rights to write comments about comments.
first:
+1I'll request you to please quit ranting. It isn't constructive in theleast. This isn't the place for it: your personal blog is. It's F/LOSS.If you don't like it, do something to change it: fork gnome3 if youwant? Here, all you need to do is install an extension. It really isn'ttoo much to ask :)
First of all you are claim that you are Fedora Ambassador. You CAN'T wrote something like this. In good faith, I'll request you to please quit from Fedora Ambassadors. It is destructive for Fedora to have representative who writes these comments. This isn't place for it: your personal blog is. Anyhow, you declare your blog as geek's blog. From my point of view Fedora is not geeky distribution, leastwise I don't experience it as that. Hope it wouldn't never become. About FOSS, I strongly recommend to you to read and learn more about FOSS, free software movement and similar subjects. If you don't like comments/complains from Fedora users do something to change it: fork it/spin it if you want. It really isn't to much to ask :)
> It *is* a *basic* thing. Are they purely aiming at a server market?> Home users *do* turn their PCs off.How difficult is pressing the alt button?I don't understand what the cribbing is all about really:1. press alt button2. install the extension3. if you use a terminal: "poweroff" works there4. use a different DE5. use windows/macAny of the above solutions will work. To avoid pressing one alt button Isee folks typing emails discussing how difficult it is to press the altbutton? Doesn't that require pressing more keys? So, since it isn'tefficiency you're after, what is it?
It is all about use cases. I don't understand what is cribbing is all about really: (my use case scenario)
1. power off by default
2. press alt button if you like to suspend/hibernate/logout
2.1 allow user to customize behaviour of button
3. install extension: users must write extensions because main functionality is not accomplished.
4. if you use terminal: type "exit" or "CTRL-D"; go to 1.
5. use a different DE: yes we have freedom of choice. My is to use GNOME (gnome-shell) with usable interface. I will ask you to read more about HCI.
6. use windows/mac (meaning OSX I assume) : you are Fedora Ambassador, this is totally inappropriate. Or maybe you got donation/payment from them?
Аny of the above solutions will work. I saw many frustrated programmers typing emails discussing how is difficult to adapt software to user use cases or wishes.
Neither am I kidding, nor am I a masochist. I just don't like randomfolks venting on mailing lists. If you haven't learnt yet, venting doesnothing. It doesn't bring any changes. All it does is waste infra.Like N number of people have already written: Install the extension, nomore alt required. From F18, you'll have your poweroff back. In themeantime, if alt is too much, and installing an extension one time istoo much, use something else. Move to another DE.
Well, we can't discuss about this issue here? If you haven't learnt yet, there is something as Freedom of speech. Comments as this lead us in any of *isms (fascism, communism). Hmmm, I will reformulate myself: all are equal, but some are more equal than others. Current status of GNOME DE satisfy your needs. I just don't like random folks persuading others on mailing list that GNOME is good or must install extension for basic functionality. Must install an extension every time with new version of GNOME, if author rewrite it because compatibility problems. If I rethink, it would be better to learn C, C++, Python, _javascript_, GNOME 3 architecture (there is a plenty docs of course) and write own extension. It would be superb only developers could using Linux. I'm afraid that would be waste of human resources. (human resources are more expensive than infrastructure)
ER: "if"? That used to mean something..What I'm suggesting is that you move to Windows/Mac if no DE in Linuxworks for you. I'm sure you won't fork a DE to customize for yourself ifyou can't install an extension or use alt. LOL.
With or without LOL, you get liberty as a Fedora Ambassador/Maintainer/Contributor in other words representative (as you wrote on your fedora user page) to write something like this?????? I find this comment as very disgusting. Linux and Fedora as part of Linux community it is not used as Desktop OS only. Just for your information.
After this comment your email address goes to my Trash filter. At least that is last freedom that I have.
Maybe your reaction is conditioned by your age. Maybe you have bad period at work. Maybe ... well I could find to many excuses for your behaviour. Seems you are forget main rule: The customer is always right. Even if he use stupid in his vocabulary. As Fedora doesn't have CRM this mail list is substitution for it.
Maybe you think that "power-off stupidity" is not part of troubleshooting Fedora? Even Fedora/Red Hat doesn't develop GNOME . I would like you to show me some place where I as Fedora user can write about other "stupidity" in GNOME or any other software included in Fedora distribution?
For a reason of constructivism:
You are constantly repeat "Move to another DE". Fine. But why Cinnamon isn't part of Fedora repo? I find there less "stupidity" than in gnome-shell. At the end: There is no stupid question, only stupid answers ( :), LOL, laughs, smile )
P.S. no hard feelings Indian Tiger
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