On Sat, 2010-03-06 at 15:22 -0800, Les wrote: > On Fri, 2010-03-05 at 22:13 -0700, Craig White wrote: > > On Sat, 2010-03-06 at 12:31 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: > > > Marcel Rieux wrote: > > > > > > > > Here's what Knode looked like when I opened it today: > > > > > > > > http://cjoint.com/?dgcNjJBH6c > > > > > > > > What's this: > > > > > > > > Loca... > > > > O... > > > > Sent > > > > Dr... > > > > > > > > Moving the vertical bar doesn't lengthen the names and I saw no option > > > > in the menus for this. Anyway, it doesn't make sense. Why do "Loca" > > > > and "Sent" have 4 letters whereas "O" has only one and "Dr" -- for > > > > drafts, I suppose -- just 2? Even if there was an option in a menu, > > > > I'm sure it couldn't create such a mess. > > > > > > > > > > > Could it be that you're not moving the correct "vertical bar"? > > > > > > I don't use knode, but I brought it up as a curiosity. Looks somewhat > > > like you describe above. However, there is a very light line between > > > "Name" and "Unread". I positioned my mouse over that and clicked and > > > held and adjusted the column width just fine. > > > > > > Are you saying that didn't work for you? Or, are you trying to adjust > > > using the wrong "bar"? > > ---- > > as is typical of all the 'kde' things (kmail, akregator, etc.), the left > > panel does indeed use a vertical column divider that's hard to locate > > but if you pass the mouse slowly, you will see <||> which indicates that > > click & hold will adjust the column width. Also, the O... and Sent and > > Dr... simply indicate what will actually fit in the column where the > > ellipses is used to indicate more. If you just widen the window, the > > column will self adjust anyway. > > > > This isn't rocket science and it's clear that the KDE programs actually > > anticipate that the user can figure this out by his/her self. Perhaps > > the KDE suite doesn't design their UI to the lowest common denominator > > that is seemingly incapable of deducing how to use their standard > > panels. > > Hi, Craig, > While those of us who use lots of applications may be familiar with the > general concepts and will prowl a bit to get the right combination, > those who use computers only for a task just what to know how to do the > things they need to do. > > This is no way unfair. > > Do you know that the car has a differential or what that does? The car > would not work without it, but it is not part of the knowledge you need > to drive the car. But you do need to realize that the wheels rotate one > way on one side and the opposite on the other and that they run at > slightly different speeds, if you are going to race. That small bit of > knowledge along with other similar bits would make you the exception on > the course and give you an advantage. It is the same with computers. ---- as I noted elsewhere in the thread, there's something very comical to using an irrelevant metaphor while trying to make an irrelevant post more relevant. ---- > > To say someone is incapable is a self aggrandizing statement, and > implies that you are better than the gentle person in question. Maybe > you are, but probably only in some areas. ditto for me. I excel in > some areas and not so good in others. But that is human. > > The point is, though, that for the computer to be useful, it must meet > the needs of the users, not the developers. It is a vital distinction. > A good engineer listens to this kind of feedback and tries to come up > with a solution. > > A foolish manager will denigrate this kind of input, and loose > credibility with both staff and customers, as well as doom his product, > whatever it might be, to obscurity. I've worked for or with some of > those from time to time, and it is an exercise in design and engineering > futility. So be open to the input, try to think how to help improve the > situation, and make our beloved linux more powerful and more useful. ---- thank you for completely missing my point. In your rush to come up with a response, you failed to actually think through the larger picture. There are many different software choices on Linux and it would be folly to suggest (as you are indeed suggesting) that all of the choices be 'dumbed' down to the lowest common denominator of users. It is perfectly valid that some software has a barrier to entry, that it requires some knowledge and intuitiveness by the user. There are large numbers of users who cannot actually use Adobe Illustrator for example... are you suggesting that because large numbers of computer users cannot actually do anything with it that it is 'doomed'? I am using this as just a single example of software that certainly meets the needs of the majority of its users but certainly isn't suitable for a great many computer users. You completely failed to differentiate that there are computer users and there are specific software items that are not intended for every computer user. In my case, I think I sort of appreciate KDE and the fact that they are trying to use some sophisticated UI elements and I'm not the least bit bothered by the fact that there are some who cannot intuit how to use their software. Last time I checked, KDE and application suites were optional installs. The fact that the OP cannot comprehend the UI of a particular program does not necessarily represent a problem with Linux at all. The only thing it certainly represents is a barrier to entry (usage). The only proven method of changing open source software is bug reporting and everything else is irrelevant. If the OP or you actually feel that the particular software (in this case Knode) has a problem, then why hasn't someone filed a bug report? ---- > > And to be honest, good documentation is a major weakness in Linux on > all fronts, from the OS itself, to the utilities. There are not enough > books and not enough well written on-line tutorials to really help the > novice, and those that do exist don't seem to ever be updated (except > for the Wiki's). > > This is all just my honest opinion based upon my personal experience. ---- You should have pointed out to the OP that if he feels that the documentation on things like UI are inadequate, he can volunteer to help improve the documentation because this is after all a participatory work (Open source software). I will simply say this... there are people who will curse the darkness and people who will light candles. I think we know where the OP fits in that equation. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- users mailing list users@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
