> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Tim <ignored_mailbox@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: For users of Fedora <fedora-list@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2007 11:17:49 PM
> Subject: Re: how to set up VM, or is there a freeware equivalent to Deep Freeze Software
>
> On Tue, 2007-08-14 at 20:45 -0700, Antonio Olivares wrote:
>
> > I have a colleague that teaches BCIS (Basic Computer Information
> > Systems) and has a computer lab. The computers are Dell Optiplex GX
> > 280.
> >
> >
> > Administering the Lab is a pain
> >
> > I told my friend that Linux could save him from many headaches
>
> Yes, it *can*, though it's not a universal panacea. Most of the
> problems are Windows-centric, you can avoid just about all of them with
> an OS switch. Though, now you'll have a new set of problems:
> Persuading a change, learning alternatives, and, perhaps, accepting an
> inability to do some things. Though the latter may not be a problem,
> the things that you mightn't be able to do may be the things you don't
> want the students to be able to do.
>
> > A student logs in, does his/her work on MS Word. Finishes and starts
> > messing with the desktop, ie. changing backgrounds, surfing the web,
> > looking for ways to bypass the firewall to visit sites like youtube,
> > MySpace, etc. He/She logs out. When another student comes in, the
> > machine is restored to its original settings, original background, no
> > programs installed no stuff. Is there such an equivalent software
> > that is open sourced?
>
> To some degree that isn't necessary. On a well secured system, a
> student can only change their own settings. They can stuff themselves
> up, but nobody else. That does leave you with dealing with how to make
> it so they can't stuff themselves up, or making it easy to recover. You
> couldn't just wipe out all their files at logout, unless you don't allow
> students to store any files on the system. You could make it so default
> settings are loaded each time, but some users might have special needs
> that need personal settings. It's a pain to have to keep customising
> things, over and over.
>
> Whether they can install software is up to the administration. You can
> prevent that, even on Windows (the problem is that many admins simply
> don't lock up the PCs enough, thinking that they need to leave them
> somewhat open, rather than ditching crap software that insists on it).
> Students would have to write their own software to get around not being
> able to "install" something. ;-)
Not that simple, these students are SHARP. They can bypass passwords, firewalls. They have very good skills in computers. They can crack passwords. Some of these kids can edit the registry and logout the administrators, and the administrators have no way of getting into the machine without reformatting it. Yes LiveCDs can crack the passwords, but the drivers on these Dell Machines do not allow the driver to be loaded, hence, the nt_pass crackers fail here.
>
> > One problem here is that the curriculum is based on M$
> > Word/Excel/PowerPoint, etc.
>
> That is a two-fold problem:
>
> Teaching word processing, spread sheeting, etc., is different than
> teaching how to use Word, Excel, etc. One is learning the technique of
> what word processing and spreadsheeting is, the other is simply learning
> how to use particular software. Quite often schools omit actual
> learning, and just use indoctrination.
>
> If they insist on it being based on those applications, they're going to
> have to use them. Of course if you can argue against indoctrination,
> you can teach word processing, etc., and do so on whatever tools can do
> that job.
>
> Some will argue that you need to teach Word, for the students knowledge
> to be applicable to the real world. But I've seen the teaching of Word
> fail miserably. The students learnt, by rote, how to do something at
> school. But couldn't transfer the knowledge to another version of Word.
> All they could manage was using Word like an electric typewriter, and
> badly, too.
>
> On the other hand, if they'd learnt word processing, they can apply that
> knowledge to any word processor, using the features that they can find,
> and reading the help guides to tailor it to the particular
> implementation.
>
> Our schools made a big mistake in ditching teaching "commerce" (the
> skills of filing, typing, finance, planning, basic legal, etc.) in
> exchange for playing with Windows. We went from having directly
> employable high school students, to having poorly skilled students who
> needed tertiary education if they want to do anything beyond being a
> shop assistant.
>
> --
> [tim@bigblack ~]$ uname -ipr
> 2.6.22.1-41.fc7 i686 i386
>
> Using FC 4, 5, 6 & 7, plus CentOS 5. Today, it's FC7.
>
> Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
> I read messages from the public lists.
>
>
I agree here with you Tim, but my friend will get into trouble if he does not follow the curriculum. People have grown up with Word -> Word Processor, Excel -> Spreadsheet and PowerPoint for presentations.
Have to find another way LTSP is a good idea, but will not go through with Administration. These computers are licensed for use with Windows. The programs like Deep Freeze are expen$ive and are out the door.
Regards,
Antonio
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