15:22 -!- mmcgrath changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Infrastructure -- Role call (late) 15:22 < mmcgrath> who's here? 15:22 * ricky 15:23 < ricky> ivazquez: I think it was supposed to be ~20 minutes ago. 15:23 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: i think we got messed up when DST ended 15:23 < mmcgrath> yeah 15:23 < dgilmore> we did not change with DST but used the same ust offset 15:24 * ricky will probably be unable to make meetings after a month or so, unfortunately. 15:24 < jcollie> heh need to add an alarm clock to zodbot 15:24 < ricky> Speaking of time... when were we going to change all time zones to UTC? 15:24 < mmcgrath> ricky: yeah we were. 15:25 < mmcgrath> ricky: its on our topic list sso lets get started 15:25 -!- mmcgrath changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Infrastructure -- Tickets 15:25 < mmcgrath> .tiny https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/query?status=new&status=assigned&status=reopened&group=milestone&keywords=%7EMeeting&order=priority 15:25 < zodbot> mmcgrath: http://tinyurl.com/2hyyz6 15:25 < paulobanon_> pong 15:25 * paulobanon_ thanks ivazquez 15:25 < mmcgrath> so first ticket 15:26 < mmcgrath> .ticket 347 15:26 < zodbot> mmcgrath: #347 (Set localtime on all our servers to UTC) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/347 15:26 < mmcgrath> I think the only main questions about this are 1) notifying everyone that the change is going to happen 2) making sure none of our apps break and 3) doing the implementation. 15:27 < mmcgrath> I've given some thought to 2 and while it might look a little odd for people going back and looking through things (like when something was built, or cacti graphs) that time might just disappear. 15:27 < paulobanon_> i think its a good thing to have 15:27 -!- glezos [n=glezos@fedora/glezos] has joined #fedora-meeting 15:27 < mmcgrath> yeah I don't think anyone is against it (if they are speak now!) 15:28 < mmcgrath> Anyone particularly interested in owning this task? I've got a backlog of stuff I've been working on. 15:28 < dgilmore> i can own it if noone else wants to 15:28 < mmcgrath> well, either way its a ticket so it'll get worked on sooner or later. 15:28 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: I say if no one claims it by tomorrow, go ahead and take it. 15:28 < mmcgrath> anyone else have any questions on that? 15:28 < dgilmore> everyone has been for the change 15:29 < ricky> It does require a reboot/downtime, right? 15:29 < mmcgrath> yeah, just a matter of doing it. 15:29 < mmcgrath> ricky: AFAIK, yes. 15:29 < dgilmore> ricky: at minimum service restarts 15:29 < mmcgrath> at least thats the safe way to do it. 15:29 < dgilmore> easier to reboot 15:29 < ricky> Ah, OK. 15:30 < mmcgrath> Alrighty, anyone have anything else on that? 15:30 < mmcgrath> .ticket 365 15:30 < zodbot> mmcgrath: #365 (mailman setup (project/hosted)) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/365 15:30 < mmcgrath> So we now have the collab servers up and can, in theory, run our own mailman instances. We will be doing this for fedorahosted. 15:30 < mmcgrath> the question is how to proceed with the fedoraproject. 15:30 < mmcgrath> jcollie: ping 15:30 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: ping 15:31 < jcollie> hello!!! 15:31 < mmcgrath> jcollie: yo 15:31 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: should could we run all of fedora's mailing lists 15:31 < ricky> I don't think we've really had many problems with Red Hat's mailman, so at the very least, there's no need to rush over at once. 15:31 < mmcgrath> so right now jcollie is point man on implementation and getting mailman actually installed. dgilmore has recently be charged by the board to figure out what our mail system should do. 15:31 < jcollie> i think that the main issue with fedoraproject is how to get mail from bastion over to collab1 15:32 < mmcgrath> ricky: thats been my primary push against hosting it ourselves though now we have the space to do it. 15:32 * jcollie thinks we should use exim :) 15:32 * dgilmore slaps jcollie 15:32 < mmcgrath> heheh 15:32 < dgilmore> :) 15:32 < mmcgrath> so there are two options here as I see them. 15:32 < mmcgrath> 1) *-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and @lists.fedoraproject.org 15:33 < mmcgrath> upon thinking about it, from the user side I'd prefer *-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and from the infrastructure team side I'd prefer @lists.fedoraproject.org 15:33 < mmcgrath> anyone have opinions on it? 15:33 < dgilmore> ricky: one thing id like to do is have a fedora themed interface for Red Hats mailman that could be accessed via lists.fedoraproject.org or fedoraproject.org/lists or something like that 15:33 < ricky> I'm leaning towards lists.fedoraproject.org too. It'll be annoying to have to blacklist a ton of mailing list names in FAS. 15:34 < dgilmore> ricky: i agree 15:34 < mmcgrath> jcollie: what are your thoughts on it? 15:34 < ivazquez> It'll be far simpler to use @lists. 15:34 < dgilmore> i like simple 15:34 < ricky> dgilmore: Ah, good point. Currently, the admin interfaces for lists allow some (probably limited) control over templates, but it'll definitely be easier with our own setup. 15:34 < paulobanon_> +1 15:34 < jcollie> i like *-lists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx i don't think it's that hard to implement 15:35 < dgilmore> ricky: and id like to alias each list on redhat.com with a fedoraproject.org address 15:35 < EvilBob> will this break users filters? 15:35 < mmcgrath> EvilBob: almost certainly. 15:35 < jcollie> if we go with lists.fedoraproject.org we should probably make that the admin interface rather than admin.fp.o/mailman 15:36 < mmcgrath> jcollie: ssl / ip restriction issues. 15:37 < mmcgrath> We're just tight on ssl certs and ip's and its so much easier to just use whats there. Afterall, you've already got admin.fp.o/mailman setup :) 15:37 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: :) agreed 15:37 < mmcgrath> and we can have a non-ssl lists.fp.o site for the archives if we wanted instead of fedoraproject.org 15:37 < jcollie> well, i guess i don't have super strong feelings either way... sending mail to lists.fedoraproject.org would be super simple 15:38 < dgilmore> i think admin.fp.o is a well known admin area 15:38 < mmcgrath> k 15:38 < mmcgrath> jcollie: and as for fedorahosted.org, we've not really talked directly about that but is it something you'd be interested in doing as well? 15:38 < dgilmore> so the question comes down. do we want to manage all lists? 15:38 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: do you mean as in admin each list, or host them? 15:38 -!- MrBawb [i=abob@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] has joined #fedora-meeting 15:39 < paulobanon_> dgilmore: what's the board position on that ? 15:39 < jcollie> yeah the puppet configs i've been working on should make it a snap to do it for fedorahosted... you'll need to run it on a different host than collab1 though 15:39 < dgilmore> or do we want to have some way to manage hosted lists ourselves and have our own frontend to the mailmain instance provided by Red Hat 15:39 < ricky> Aw, so there'd have to be two separate setups? 15:39 < dgilmore> paulobanon_: boards take is what do the users want/ and is simple for them 15:40 < jcollie> ricky: yeah... virtual hosting in mailman is possible but a lot more tricky 15:40 < mmcgrath> jcollie: <nod> we'll be runing them on the hsoted box. 15:41 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: whats your prefered way with the fedoraproject mail? 15:41 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: im kinda leaning towards keeping them on the RH side just because its less work 15:41 < paulobanon_> i dont have a personal feeling either way, but we should consider the administration costs vs the benefits :) 15:42 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: should we have jcollie focus on fedorahosted for now? 15:42 < dgilmore> but having some fedora frontends for it 15:42 < jcollie> i'd say any new fedora related lists we run on collab1 but keep the existing ones @redhat 15:42 < paulobanon_> dgilmore: aka fedora look n'feel :) 15:42 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: probably unless he wants to setup for all and we work a migration plan away from @lists.redhat.com 15:42 < dgilmore> paulobanon_: yeah 15:43 < ricky> Personally, I kind of like having the same interface on all mailman instances that I use. 15:43 < mmcgrath> jcollie: so from here on, what would it take to get a mailing list setup for the @fedorahosted.org people? 15:44 < lmacken> ugh.. mailman 15:44 < jcollie> well, i've got to get the puppet configs finished, then it's a matter of applying them to the fedorahosted box 15:45 < jcollie> new lists can be created by editing the puppet configs so pretty easy to admin 15:45 < abadger1999> jcollie: I like one-stop-shopping though. So having fedora-infrastructure on rh.com and fedora-devel-ng on fedoraproject.org seems like a drawback. 15:45 < mmcgrath> jcollie: ahh, thats one thing I wanted to talk to you about. 15:45 < abadger1999> (Refering to all new lists on collab1) 15:45 < mmcgrath> So as it stands, none of the fedorahosted projects are in puppet, we have them all under /srv on fedorahosted and we run a script to create them. 15:45 < ricky> Cool - I always assumed that they were created by a script. 15:46 < jcollie> abadger1999: yeah, but you're gonna break bazillions of people mail filters by moving the lists 15:46 < mmcgrath> jcollie: and thats the real dilema, whats the benefit of the move? 15:46 * nirik notes we could look at the mailing list reorg at the same time as moving them.... 15:46 < ricky> I don't see huge benefits in moving - right now, the big thing is that we're gaining the ability to create lists quickly, right? 15:47 < jcollie> 1) it's run on the fedora infrastructure 2) we can give the front ends the fedora look'n'feel 15:47 < lmacken> it may also be a good opportunity to look into toshio's notification server ideas 15:47 < lmacken> .ticket 151 15:47 < zodbot> lmacken: #151 (Explore idea of a notification server) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/151 15:47 < notting> can we do #2 without actually moving things? 15:47 < mmcgrath> number 2) might be able to be done without moving things. 15:47 < jcollie> yeah, we can create new lists as quickly as you can edit the puppet configs 15:47 < mmcgrath> notting: dgilmore is working on that. or looking into it. 15:47 < EvilBob> Is having "quick lists" a real long term bene however? then we end up with less thought going in to lists and a bunch of poorly planned dead lists 15:48 < mmcgrath> jcollie: I don't know that we want to do that in puppet though, we might just want to script it on hosted like we do with the rest of the hosted projects. 15:48 < mmcgrath> its kind of an odd "content vs config" mix on fedorahosted. 15:49 < EvilBob> icanhascheezymailinglist? 15:49 < mmcgrath> jcollie: here's how we currently create hosted projects (it could use some work) - http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/ProjectHosting/CreateNewProject 15:49 < jcollie> yeah, it is a little bit wierd because you can only affect the initial setup of the lists... any other config changes have to be done through the normal mm methods 15:49 < dgilmore> notting: im trying to find out what it would take to give the @redhat.com lists a fedora look and feel without breaking anything 15:49 < mmcgrath> jcollie: we can chat about that after the meeting whats the best way to create / maintain the lists. 15:50 < jcollie> mmcgrath: i'm good either way... 15:50 < mmcgrath> jcollie: excellent. So for now I think the path of least resistance (and way to prove that it'll be easy for us) is to get mailman setup in fedorahosted. 15:50 < mmcgrath> dgilmore: will you continue to look into this branded issue / non-issue? 15:51 < jcollie> yeah that'll be pretty easy 15:51 < mmcgrath> jcollie: in that case I have... YET ANOTHER group for you to join :) sysadmin-hosted 15:51 -!- stickster_afk is now known as stickster_work 15:51 < jcollie> heh heh 15:51 < dgilmore> mmcgrath: yep i will 15:52 < mmcgrath> solid, so for now I'll leave this on the meeting. It seems to be a pretty hot topic at times, might as well continue talking about it. 15:52 < mmcgrath> anyone have anything else on that? if not we'll move on (we started alte so we don't have much time left) 15:52 < jcollie> i think that we should set some standard for fh.o list names 15:53 < mmcgrath> <nod> I'll add that to the ticket. 15:53 < jcollie> i propose <project>-<something>-list (-<something>) could be omitted 15:53 < mmcgrath> right now we don't really have anything like that. 15:53 < mmcgrath> just a reminder for those interested in followign the ticket, add yourselves to the cc 15:54 < mmcgrath> .ticket 365 15:54 < zodbot> mmcgrath: #365 (mailman setup (project/hosted)) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/365 15:54 < mmcgrath> ok, next ticket 15:54 < mmcgrath> .ticket 270 15:54 < zodbot> mmcgrath: #270 (Fedora Wiki allows editing raw HTML) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/270 15:54 < mmcgrath> ricky: ^^^ d00d 15:54 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: ^^ 15:54 < mmcgrath> we're just waiting on the 1.6 moin epel instance? 15:54 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: are you blocking on me for something there? 15:54 < paulobanon_> pending on 15:54 < paulobanon_> .ticket 363 15:54 < zodbot> paulobanon_: #363 (fedoraproject.org/wiki - Moin upgrade) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/363 15:54 < paulobanon_> :) 15:54 < mmcgrath> k, did moin 1.6 make it into epel yet or was that waiting on me to build it? 15:54 < ricky> Getting somewhat pressed for time too, unfortunately :( 15:55 < paulobanon_> so mmcgrath since i dont have any koji access if you could throw a build it would be nice 15:55 < mmcgrath> ricky: thats ok, thanks for letting us know, I'll make sure to not pile so much stuff on ya :) 15:55 < paulobanon_> thias only commited his stuff to devel 15:56 < paulobanon_> we are allowed to co-maintain the package if we want, so its not pending on anyone anymore besides us 15:56 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: would you mind rebuilding the srpm for EL-5 and giving it a quick test? If not no worries I'll do it before I rebuild it'll just take me a bit. 15:56 < paulobanon_> mmcgrath: ill try to fit that tomorrow on my todo list 15:56 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: excellent, I appreciate it. 15:56 < mmcgrath> Ok, last ticket. 15:56 < paulobanon_> ill rebuild it in CentOS5.1 ?! 15:57 < mmcgrath> .ticket 302 15:57 < zodbot> mmcgrath: #302 (Moin patches) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/projects/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/302 15:57 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: that'd work fine, you can even just rebuild it on publictest10 15:57 < mmcgrath> MrBawb: ping 15:57 * ricky didn't get a reply to the epydoc package yet either. 15:58 -!- petreu [n=peter@fedora/Standby] has quit "( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )" 15:58 < mmcgrath> MrBawb: ping? 15:58 < mmcgrath> we can come back to that, almost out of time. 15:58 < mmcgrath> thats the last of the tickets, I did have one SOP I added this week: 15:59 < mmcgrath> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/SOP/InfrastructureRepo 15:59 < mmcgrath> how to make RPM's and sign for the infrastructure repo. 15:59 < mmcgrath> And thats really the last of the things that I've got 15:59 -!- mmcgrath changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Infrastructure -- Open Floor 16:00 < mmcgrath> Anyone have anything they'd like to discuss? 16:00 < ricky> I might have missed this in the past week or so, but any update on the xen1 problems? 16:00 < MrBawb> mmcgrath: oh, I'm here now 16:00 < mmcgrath> ricky: sorry, yes I closed the ticket, the old FC6 and the new RHEL5 kernel both fixed the problem. Just waiting for RH to release the official RPM for RHEL. 16:01 < mmcgrath> MrBawb: anything new with ticket 302? 16:01 < MrBawb> work's been busy lately, so I haven't made any progress 16:01 < mmcgrath> no worries, thanks for the update. 16:01 < mmcgrath> alllrighty, and with that we're at the end of the meeting (Sorry for starting so late) 16:01 < abadger1999> Quick update: Vacuum policy for postgres dbs. I'll be running a script to accumulate some stats. 16:01 < ricky> mmcgrath: Aha, nice. 16:01 < abadger1999> Then create a cron job to vacuum tables. 16:02 < abadger1999> Should be in place next week. 16:02 < mmcgrath> abadger1999: excellent, it will be nice to be able to benchmark whats going on there. One of the problems we had this last time was "that feels slow" but had no actual data to back up how it used to be. 16:02 < mmcgrath> If no one has anything else, I'll close the meeting in 30 16:02 < paulobanon_> mmcgrath: stickum, i'm trying to package it correctly, and i'll probably ask some stuff to our TG gurus (lmacken and abadger1999) :) 16:02 -!- giarc_w [i=hidden-u@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] has quit "Leaving" 16:03 < mmcgrath> paulobanon_: thats excellent. 16:03 < mmcgrath> 15 16:03 < mmcgrath> 10 16:03 < ricky> Hm, did nirik have a package too? 16:03 < mmcgrath> nirik: ping 16:03 < paulobanon_> ricky: its the same :) 16:03 < mmcgrath> ahh well then 16:03 < mmcgrath> nirik: unping 16:03 < paulobanon_> hehe 16:03 < ricky> paulobanon_: Aha - I've kind of lost track of things this week. 16:03 < mmcgrath> ok guys, thanks for coming 16:03 < nirik> I started working on one, but paulobanon_ wanted to, so I gave him what I had. ;) 16:03 -!- mmcgrath changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Infrastructure -- Meeting closed
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