Hello, I am a systems engineer, managing a mid scale infrastructure in AWS and data centers (few thousand servers). While I am not entirely sure if this is the right thread to bring this point up or not, I would still like to share my concerns. Please forgive me, if this looks too far from the topic. For me, I often have to move away from Fedora Cloud or Server editions because of limited support cycle. I don't want to run a distribution in my production environment where security updates won't be available after a short amount of time. I am not sure if atomic updates or ostree would help here. I would love to run more of Fedora Cloud or Server instances if, at least, security updates are supported for a longer time. That said, I still have a fair number of instances running in production because Fedora often packages newer releases of tools and software which is required to run some of the applications. Aditya Patawari http://blog.adityapatawari.com/ https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Adimania India On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 4:07 AM, Matthew Miller <mattdm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > I've spent the last 3+ years asking people what they would like from a > guest operating system in the cloud. Sometimes framed as "Why did you > choose Fedora?", sometimes as "Why didn't you choose Fedora?", and > sometimes basically the generic question. > > I'd say that overall, the reason people say that they chose what they > did was either familiarity, or that they found documentation — or > another person — doing a similar thing, and they just followed whatever > OS that had. > > When I ask what they *want*, though, there's a somewhat different > story. It's pretty universal, though: a small, simple base without much > risk, and a library of components to go on top of that. > > Fedora Cloud Base is a decent job of being a small base, although we > still have a lot of dependency bloat and updates churn. But the library > of stuff — languages, services — is difficult. We've got a great set of > packages, but they're largely irrelevant, because the versions are > usually changing too quickly. Mostly, you've got to bring your own > stacks. > > I'd hoped that we could answer this by slimming down the base and then > offering a wide selection of SCLs on top. But, I don't think that's > really panning out. The base is way less minimal than I'd like, and I > don't know a good way to manage the updates situation. And SCLs are > both still somewhat stuck *and* unlikely to explode (in the good sense) > if they get unstuck. > > For people who chose Fedora Cloud already — familiarity, or they found > someone else familiar — we're probably okay. No one has anything > negative to say about the work we've done — in fact, people who have > chosen it generally say good things. I think it's very useful to keep > producing Fedora Cloud Base for that group. But... it's a small club. > > So, enter Atomic Host plus containers. This is, basically, exactly what > people have been asking for. The ostree tech brings some order to the > base, making updates more reliable and testable. And containers bring > us the library of components — at the very least making it easier to > bring your own, and ideally providing a new, better way for us to offer > different versions, possibly with a different lifecycle. > > That's why I'd like to move the Cloud Base image to a dedicated > cloud.fedoraproject.org page along the lines of > http://arm.fedoraproject.org, and replace Cloud with Atomic Host as a > top level on <https://arm.fedoraproject.org/>, and to rename Cloud WG > to Atomic WG (but still keeping the Cloud SIG to work on the Base > image). > > This is all just my 2¢, but I hope you'll consider them 2¢ with a lot > of prior listening. If you have a counter story which will help us > significantly grow adoption of Cloud Base *instead*, I'd love to hear > it. > > > -- > Matthew Miller > <mattdm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Fedora Project Leader > _______________________________________________ > cloud mailing list > cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/cloud > Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct _______________________________________________ cloud mailing list cloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/cloud Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
